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ctown28
ctown28
Tireless Tiger

Apr-16-2009 10:18

I wanted to start this thread to get some opinions from others in the community about the advantages that some players/agencies have over one another. I am not saying my thoughts on them are right or wrong nor am I saying that anybody else’s is. In fact, you may see me flip flop on the topics from time to time as I sometimes like to look at both sides.

What I do not want to see here is for this to turn into a flame war and/or any name calling. Remember, it doesn’t matter if you have been here for 10 days or 1000 days. Every opinion of someone that pays to play the game carries just as much weight as the next person.

A good debate can be healthy for the community and I ask you to all stay respectful here even if you disagree with something that is said here. I will start with some topics and would like to see them discussed and if anyone thinks I missed something or would like to add a topic, by all means go for it.



Replies

topkebab
topkebab
Lucky Stiff

Apr-20-2009 05:12

(Holy cow, 4 posts. Don't worry, this is the last one.)

All cases for a single detective.
OK, imho this is a silly debate. Some people are egotistical and like to see their name above everyone elses. You can't help them. Some people want to help a newbie gain XP. I remember when I was a newbie I really wanted to do as many cases as i could get my hands on because i enjoyed the game and was excited every time i could move up a level of difficulty.

Finally.
I like the idea of resetting favours at turnover, if you are holding one. Not losing it completely, that would be a waste of three cases, but a randomly generated new one after midnight, which actually means there's a 10% chance that it stays the same.

Also I would like to put forward the idea of a separate "subscribers" board within City Hall, which would be a better place for a thread like this than on a board open to any and all newbie. It was pointed out to me that there is a subscribers centre with a message board on it but i have RSI from playing too much sleuth, i prefer two less clicks ;)

I'm not sure if i missed any points, there are so many! I have to look away from the screen now, before my eyes fuse together.

Sleuth Sindy
Sleuth Sindy
Pinball Wizard

Apr-20-2009 06:08

Okay, I did a Google search on the term "snake in the grass," and I realize now that they way it has been used in my family is not the general understanding of the meaning of this term, and I can see how someone would be offended by my apparent misuse of the term here.

My family has always used it simply to mean something that doesn't go well or something you don't like. i.e. The copier at my job breaks down almost every day and I have to work in a very cramped space. I like my job but you know, there's always a snake in the grass (or two or three).

Again, I am very sorry that I posted offended anyone. That was certainly NOT my intention.

Adam Carter
Adam Carter
Big Winner

Apr-20-2009 06:59

After reading all the posts here, the general consensus of the community seems to be "let's not rock the boat." To me, this is disheartening. A couple of years ago, when the game was running at full steam, people would debate and argue anything, from password sharing and "2 subs in one agency", right down to whether or not to consider one of Nephi's ideas. The spirit within the community was that of competition, and it spilled out into gameplay, with people constantly battling to become #1. Now though, it seems that everyone is content to just "get on with it."

I'm not going to go over everything that has been said here, as most of it has been summed up pretty well. I do agree with SS though, we really do need a set of rules in this game. It's more fun to compete and win when you are restricted than when it's an open field. A simple set of rules, to tell us our do's and do not's cant hurt. People can only really object to them if they would be stopped from doing something they already do.

I do believe though that the 2 subs thing has been blown out of all proportion with regards to THing. For me that isn't where the issue lies. You can do far more damage in an agency that compliantly password shares than an agency where the 12 subs are run by one person. An example to that point is my old agency, Hitchhikers: London. Nobody in that agency had more than 2 of their own detectives, yet we were able to sweep probably 1/3 of all the treasure hunts played during our active time. That was done because one person at a time had control over the whole agency. We all took turns in it, but essentially the principle was the same. Plus it was easier for us than it would be for one person alone, as it was harder for us to burn out. Though it did happen eventually.

Adam Carter
Adam Carter
Big Winner

Apr-20-2009 06:59

To that end, I would like to issue the members of Sleuthville a challenge: Let's play this game the way it was intended to. Ditch the helper tools, and pick up a pen and paper. You can use notepad if you disagree with tree wastage. Treat the case files as a "last ditch" solution, and really try to solve cases yourself before passing them on for PE checking. Then allow yourself one case a day to be checked, and let someone else check it themselves. If you have more than 1 sub, play all your cases on the character they originated from. It's more fun to play cases on different detectives with different skills. If you TH, then only play your own favours, not anyone elses. Pretend that we can't password share, and let other people do the work on their own detectives. Maybe even start a new detective (they can even be unsubbed) and try to get them as much experience as possible unaided. Try it for as long as you like, all I ask is that everyone tries it for a day. If you don't find it more fun, then go back to playing the way you do now. If you do, then stick at it. And like Sleuth Sindy said, once you complete that 3-note case alone without getting help from the Librarian, then you'll remember why you loved the game so much.

topkebab
topkebab
Lucky Stiff

Apr-20-2009 07:19

Apparently I missed Sleuth Sindy's "snake in the grass". Apologies to kenb.

And to Sleuth Sindy ;)

I've never heard the expression, I had to google it too.

Lolita Marinez
Lolita Marinez
Sleuth About Town

Apr-20-2009 08:43

Sindy. Kenb picked every negative word he could find out of every post. He used my "dishonourable" which I only used because I was discussing the honour system. It was a word that fit the context of what I was writing. It was certainly not "aimed" at anyone. Geez I have only been here a couple of months. I don't get the inner workings of the great Sleuth Machine and I am still finding out who is who is who is who. LOL. oh and also who is who and who and who. LOL.

Please don't take all the blame on yourself Sindy. He attacked a lot of us and used our words against us when some of us (namely ME) haven't even met him and wouldn't have the faintest idea that he had more than 1 sub!

Joey
Joey "Bulldog" Bane
Washed Up Punter

Apr-20-2009 14:45

Since this is my first post in this thread, I'll follow the example of some people above and approach each original point in order.

The helpers...

These helpers are basically nothing more than information trackers, tools that help a player move faster through a case. Once you've established the possible number of suspects per case difficulty, all helpers do the same thing: Dr. Watson is the 'pen and paper' on the screen, Pidgeot's is 'Dr. Watson for the lazy ones' (like me), Huglover's is an advanced Pidgeot's as it simply reduces the number of mouse clicks. None of them are 'case solvers' and thus none of them offer a real advantage. Oh, and about the VH helper, c'mon...it ain't brain surgery to print a map, draw some lines and check who's a man and who's a woman; it doesn't make one a better VH hunter, but just reduces the nailing time from 3 minutes down to 1.

So, basically, the helpers only offer the advantage of time. Now, in my point of view, we're all spending time of our lives playing here, so if we can spend less and do the same thing, why not? Helpers don't put one on top of the lists, but the number of cases done per day does.

Now for the second subject: password sharing and multiple subbes...

As Ddog and others have mentioned, there can be multiple and reasonable reasons for password sharing; the only 'advantage' this can create is during treasure hunts. (will get back to the advantage issue below)

As about the multiple subbes, again, there can be many reasons for this too, besides getting on top of the list. For instance, I was stupid enough to retire the detective I had about a year ago when I had to leave the game because of RL, so I boosted my new char by creating some more subbes and getting them contacts in NY, in order to reach faster a point where I can enjoy the game at its full capacity. So, what I'm saying is that I used this possibility simply for improving my gaming experience, without seeing it as an advantage.

Joey
Joey "Bulldog" Bane
Washed Up Punter

Apr-20-2009 15:15

Ok, now back to the advantage issue...

The question is: why are we playing this game? There has been a mention that this is an 'adult' community. So I'm asking: how many of us play the game to be on top of a list? I myself simply play it for pleasure and I'm sure that at least 90% of the players do it for the same reason. How many adults can find an accomplishment feeling in spending full days in front of the computer and paying cash from their pockets for getting on top of a game list? I mean...what would I say to my wife if I did that?...'Babe, we can't go to the theatre tonight because I have to solve 100 cases and be on top of Sleuh list...and you should love me for that because it's a proof I'm a real man!" A bit hilarious when you look at it this way, ain't it?

Now, of course, the '90% pleasure playing members' is a personal assumption, but I tend to think it's not far from the truth. And when you see things like that, you can't actually consider the idea of 'advantage', let alone whether it's fair or not.


Ok...subject no. 3 - the rules...

A couple of days ago I was watching an interview with a lady who travelled all around the globe. She said something that seemed to me to be a basic truth (the kind that you know, but can't pinpoint on request): "There are no civilised people (as in countries), but there are only sanctioned people."

This is a fact of life and of the human nature: as long as a rule is not enforced, it is not a law and thus can be broken and 'will be' broken. Values are nothing if they are not enforced by law.

Again, this is a personal opinion, but I can guarantee based on it that as long as the sistem (being the enforcement in this case) will allow braking of the 'moral rules', they will be broken.

Joey
Joey "Bulldog" Bane
Washed Up Punter

Apr-20-2009 15:22

About the 'snake in the grass' incident...what can I say...in my eyes is simply an adult's twisted interpretation of a text, followed by a child's reaction. All I can say to King is: What you care anyway what anybody says or thinks? Do what you gotta do or what you feel like doin'! Your right and wrong has to be the only true right and wrong to you. Also...remember we're in a game and any constant voice in a game community (especially in an adult one) is a simple game addict.

I know some of the readers will be offended by what I said, but I'm a game addict myself and admitting it out loud is honesty towards my own person.

Done.

Anais Nin
Anais Nin
Thespian

Apr-20-2009 15:50

Here are my thoughts on the matters brought up thus far...

Automated Helpers: I have tried a few of them, and they are ok. I haven't tried Huglover's but from what I have heard, I don't think I would like it. I like the clicking and asking for myself! ;) I sometimes use Pidgeot's, but, for the most part I use a spreadsheet I made myself on a Microsoft app that stays on top of the other screens so I don't have to keep switching screens. :) I usually have had enough of note-taking by the end of the day that I don't feel like using more paper. ;)

Password Sharing: One person here has one of my two detective's passwords. While I don't agree with the demanding of people's passwords, I don't have a problem with having someone or a few people have another person's password, as long as it is known and understood that nothing will be deleted from the in-box, or sent from the detective, or posted on the boards.

Multiple Subscriptions: As I just mentioned above, I have two subs. It is a little more than I can handle some days, and on other days, I could handle more. If someone has the time and inclination to play more, I would say go for it! But just do all of the cases on that one detective. I was thinking it might be interesting later on to try out each of the 6 beginning types to see which is the best for beginning. I already know that tough and charming is NOT it. I can see why the rule of two subbed per person in a single agency was put into effect, but if there are a group of people who live in the same time zone or are always on at the same time are in the same agency, then they have the same advantage as someone who does a TH by themself.

*more*



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