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More than two subs in same agency....
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Secret_Squirrel
Secret_Squirrel
Safety Officer

Jun-17-2012 17:57

Everything old is new again... or maybe not.

And let me start with a preemptive "Puh-lease, freedom of speech and all that aside, let's not turn this in to a debacle."

So, 'some' people have been getting up my a... err I mean politely pointing out to me, that the whole "some people have more than two subs in the same agency, and isn't that against the 'rules'" is banging away behind the scenes.

I've asked Ben to look at this with a view to scrapping the concept that more than two subs in the same agency is a 'bad' thing.

To be bluntly honest it's never been particularly well policed unless it was by self-policed by certain players who were trying to edge out the competition in Treasure Hunts.

My personal opinion is that the 'againsts' never really equalled the 'fors', and that we're at the point where as a community the TH scene just isn't that cutthroat any more.

So, I'm more than happy to go with the flow, as I suspect no-one really minds anymore.

But I'll leave the final word to Ben, of course.

Please feel free to discuss politely.

Please limit your lunatic ravings to a minimum nic :D

Replies

Eden Zweig
Eden Zweig
Nomad

Jun-18-2012 09:33

Someone leaves the game because of accusations concerning multiple accounts and I am saying that if this Mod wants to be honest about it, really, s/he had better ask the game developers about that. Don't know if Ben is one of the creators/owners of this game so I was speaking in general terms.

Choosing one among people who have clones and accusing him, rather than preferring a general statement as to what this game is lacking and making this statement to game developers... I'm saying that this sounds bad.

Ken could only be an example to this case. It's the rules that need or need not be devised. Not people.

As for the rest of it... Well that's intended for few people to understand, so np there I guess :)

Eden Zweig
Eden Zweig
Nomad

Jun-18-2012 11:11

Update: heard both sides of it now(chose a Mod and asked about it) and I can safely say there've been misunderstandings.

No one seems to have been picked out specifically, from what I understand, but things somehow have lead them to think so. That's when I chose to get involved, 'cause one of those persons used to be my team mate. I just wish he returns and checks it out to see whether this really happened the way he thought it did - in case this is the reason he left, I mean.

Vampiric Smile
Vampiric Smile
Safety Officer

Jun-19-2012 00:25

Ken has announced his resignation from Sleuth World with the following msg

From: Sean King
To: Vampiric Smile
Sent: May 31, 2012 - 14:56
Hi Constantine,

I have been without internet for the last 3 days, and just now got it back. There was a message from a moderator stating that I can only have 2 detectives that are registered to me in your agency and I will have to have 2 of them leave. I am in a quandry now. I do not have as much time as I used to and I am more than a little tired of the back-biting that goes on here in Sleuth. The moderator says that people have been complaining and I have a hunch that is probably only one or 2 people, but I think it best that I just quit Sleuth for now. Maybe some day in the future, but I don't know about that either.

Sorry, but it seems the best thing for me to do.

Ken

It is obvious that he consider moderator's msg (or the undrground discussion around) as back-biting and he also thinks that the moderator is exagerating on the number of complains she/he has received.

As this is the appropriate board for the moderator to express her/himself I would like to invite her/him to copy -paste the msg she/he has sent to ken and share with us her/his opinion on the issue we are discussing
Is the honest and direct way that will clear all posible misunderstandings

Chwanes
Chwanes
Lucky Stiff

Jun-19-2012 01:27

Being another Veteran Member of SMRT, i feel that its my duty to chime in here also.
As you say Nic if someone as the time and money, so be it let them go for it all they are really doing is allowing themselves more time in the sleuth Universe, Having extra Fun AND they are also helping to keep this game flowing and functional by throwing their Real world Money into the Fray VIA Subscriptions, I myself only have one Detective (Boooo Me) but i jave had more than One in the Past and i didnt SHAMELESSLY use all 24 Cases on the one Detective, I levelled up both which were 2 completely Diff Character with Diff skill sets and the Such, I did it for LOVE of this Game and i wanted and still do wanna spend as much time here as possible, and lets face it dont you all?
AnyWay SMRT rules!!!
Chwanes OUT!!

Joey
Joey "Bulldog" Bane
Washed Up Punter

Jun-19-2012 04:56

Hell...I thought we were all here for some general relaxation and fun.

I'll spend my 2 cents on the subject by enforcing Night Queen's opinion. Couldn't have said it better myself...but I could've said it between two shots of scotch... Hey...I'm silver! Strange feeling... Got to fix this.

cfm
cfm
Nomad

Jun-19-2012 09:11

Thank you for sharing your concern, VS. I would like to point that Ken is aware of the disscussion on this topic and, as I understand it, is awaiting the results of Ben's decision just like the rest of us. This isn't really about one person, though it has directly affected one of our dear friends greatly. (Which is a shame, I agree. However, Ken was considering a Sleuth hiatus for RL reasons before this issue arose. So please give him the credit for being able to make his own choices once this issue is resolved.)

I do not think that copying and pasting private messages into a public thread helps advance the resolution. Especially since there is an effort (this thread is part of it) to get this resolved. Please know that this is not the mods against the community. Sometimes things happen, are misunderstood, or mistakes are made. A public discussion is not always appropriate for every detail of problem solving.

In the end, Ben has always been fair and open about the decisions he makes. He has never acted as a dictator and has repeatedly shown his willingness to listen to, and highly encouraged feedback from, the community.

Since he has family and all, I don't think offering him a little more of our patience is an unreasonable request. We are all awaiting his input and the resolution of this concern. This thread is a place for everyone to voice their thoughts, not necessarily to make demands.

And for the record, my opinion as a player, is that our community would be better served to drop a rather old, unofficial rule and let us all get back to having fun. If that isn't the decision that is made, I do hope that there is a more formal documentation of this expectation of self policing so that we don't have Rule Lawyers digging into everyone's trash cans.

Jason Arends
Jason Arends
Lucky Stiff

Jun-19-2012 09:45

Cfm has an excellent point, the last thing we need here (of all places) is a mod vs player discussion started, we're all here to have fun and get along. The mods here are NOT sleuth police, they keep the boards clean and try to keep the peace, lets not ask for more than that, shall we? We're all on the same side and love the game.

I'll happily and patiently await Ben's wisdom and ruling on all this and id advise everyone else to do the same.

Vampiric Smile
Vampiric Smile
Safety Officer

Jun-19-2012 10:41

I fully agree with almost all points that cfm is mentioning, A valuable input indeed

-In no way this is a discussion of mods against community. I strongly believe that the behaviour of one mod is not to be applied to mods community in any direct or indirect way.
Mods have a valuable role and most of them are doing an excellent job. Just to name 2 as an example(are far more than two).a)nicnic did a great effort to resolve this issue and is still trying hard, b)SS has during the years shown a remarkable behaviour in resolving issues and offers fruitful input and good advices whenever he is asked for (I have personally attacked him many times during my V days but I admit I was wrong for doing so)

-I totally agree that we should trust the opinion of Ben and give him time to respond. In reality the later he responds... the better as more opinions will come in . I strongly believe in democracy and I want all voices to be heard. This is why I have openly invited the mod that has accused ken to share his/her opinion with us. As the majority of the speakers up till now are favoring the disapearence of the old rule ...I would like him/her to share with us his/hers opposite way of thinking and actually help Ben in his decision taking

My only minor disagrement is the fact that( as a stronlgy believe in democracy ) I think that ALL issues can be openly discussed if we simply respect each other. Ken's problem arised from a private msg not from an open discussion. The more open we are in public even in small details the less misunderstanding will occur.


Serges
Serges
Vigilante

Jun-19-2012 10:59

I think people's concern, Vampiric, is not that it's being discussed openly... it's pretty clear people are on board with expressing their opinions on this matter in a forum setting. I think the concern is that messages which were sent through private channels between 2 individuals are being shared in the open.

If, for instance, you had wanted to paraphrase the nature of the message Ken received, I think that wouldn't have ruffled any feathers. Posting it verbatim though, I think, gives people cause for concern that their private communications could be "compromised" down the road, if a similar situation comes up. It's a touch unsettling, that's all... :)

Serges
Serges
Vigilante

Jun-19-2012 11:01

Also, and this is purely a personal take on the matter...

I had the pleasure of meeting Ken in person back in 2006. He's a fantastic person, and if he's considering leaving SOLELY because someone somewhere leveled some sort of accusation against him, well that makes me sad.

If you're still in touch with him VS, please send my best wishes along if you would.

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