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OT: Tsunami, Earthquake . S & SW Asia
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Rivergallery
Rivergallery

Dec-26-2004 17:22

Just wanted to put out my thoughts and prayers to family and friends of all those lost, and suffering loss of life, home and general safety due to the Earthquake and folowing tsunami and aftershocks of Sundays (Sumatra time) (8:00 p.m. EST Saturday evening).. which is about 6pm sleuth time I think.

Anyway Delvin is in Singapore and he should be safe, but usually logs on daily and I haven't heard from him, and he does know people that would have been in effected areas.

So any good thoughts you want to send him, or people there feel free to add on to my posting.

HOPE if anyone else here lives in SAsia or SW ASIA are safe and everyone they know are also.

Again Prayers and my good wishes to those in that part of our world.

Rivergallery.

Replies

Madame TBird
Madame TBird
Well-Connected

Dec-30-2004 10:26

Jstkdn,
If you want to rant & rave about the war. Start a new post.

Majandra Belial
Majandra Belial

Dec-30-2004 15:15

So what if there isn't any clean water, steady food supplies, or electricity - isn't it such a relief to hear that the sunbathers are back on the coast?

Rivergallery
Rivergallery

Dec-30-2004 16:55

I didn't realize that $ is worth less if it a lower % of a countries income. I wonder if we take the % in humanitarian aid from the US government compared to that of other governments what it would relate to... and is it nessessary to give the same % if the money is so monumentally more?..... Currently though I do know the UK has pledged more than the US to this effort. Supplies and people etc hasn't been added into the US effort, so I wonder what the total "pledge" is. Also if a country pledges more is that more important than who is DOing more. The countries effected are doing much more than onlookers can because they are THERE.

Just wanted to mention that Since the US is one of the richest nations.... our citizens own corporations that can do things like Pfizer Inc. Which donated $10million and$25million in drugs to relief agencys. And CocaCola- who has a plant in India was delivering water in these days after the tsunami and also $10million in aid.
There are lots of online groups collecting donations even Google and Yahoo.. not to mention amazon.
Other companies are donating % of proceeds from sales of certain items.

I think one of the biggest issues is not what $ is promised but what actually gets to the people.

India is currently declining aid so throwing $ at them just isn't going to work.

One of the biggest helps right now are the actual people on the ground, which $ isn't going to help, it is more the people, planes, and boats etc that is needed right now, I think this is such a big issue for many all over the world, that we will not let a $ need pass.
Also in most cases initial $ isn't that important it is the ongoing longterm restabilization of the region... the ongoing $ that is going to become the issue. They have a lot of rebuilding to do. And I think the UN and the coalitions set up will be able to deal with that more effectively and put the money and resourses where they are the most needed, and where they are accepted.

Rivergallery
Rivergallery

Dec-30-2004 16:56

Also.... "don't look a gift horse in the mouth"

jstkdn
jstkdn
Well-Connected

Dec-30-2004 17:47

Unfortunately, that is always the question how much money actually makes it there. I have a few friends that work for agencies that collect the money for disasters of all sorts, some of which also directed to this goal. The figures of what does not make it out there can be shocking, but it depends on who you donate too. The figures that you see, can often be misunderstood though. The coordination effort of collecting money, organizing goods, people, airplanes, logistics etc...costs a lot of money. Then again, there are a few known agencies, where money even locally ends up in the wrong hands. And the CEO travels everywhere first class. Kind of like those budget travel lonely planet writers, they haven't stayed in a budget hotel for decades.

I think the combination people vs goods need to be weighed carefully. But people like the red cross, have a lot of experience with that. I like the way the red cross put it "the country red crosses world wide, will SUPPORT the Indonesian/Sri Lanka Red cross....." (i.e. not take over the effort, with what 30-50 red crosses it can get a mess.) One day after disaster, the international red cross, knew exactly how many tents combined by all country red cross chapters were going over in total. That is a sign of good coordination. Also important that not all aid goes to the same 3 places

Tbird, if you read my post carefully, you would have noticed I was talking that disasters can bring miracles that change the world for the better, for the future. WWII is a good example of that. And my hopes are simple, that this disaster will in the end too.
A start would be, that those countries get the same warning systems, some other countries do, the same disaster plans etc. There were several hours between small waves, and the big wave disasters....but no one knew who to call.
We take for granted to hear a siren when something goes wrong, we know we have to close our windows, and listen to the TV or radio. They don't even have a siren.

Madame TBird
Madame TBird
Well-Connected

Dec-30-2004 21:19

Okay first, look at the demographics of the region. The people plagued by this tragedy were already some of the most poverty stricken people in the world. There leaders have deal with hunger, poverty & rampant illnesses on a broad scale already. Would you worry about pouring millions of dollars into a an ocean monitoring system? When there hasn't even been a substantial tsunami in about years. All the while you are funding a scientific project, more & more of your countrymen are dying of starvation. THESE GOVERNMENTS DID NOT HAVE THE MONEY! These are some very pitiful people in South Asia & Africa.
Everybody needs to wake up & shut up about what should have been. I'll tell you what should have been done. The western nations should have been doing more to help these countries way before now. Yes, a tsunami warning system would have been nice. Sending large aid packages & having people on the ground there, should have been in place way before now. The tsunami has helped to awaked the rest of the world that these are human beings like rest of us. I get so mad thinking that it has taken a tragedy for everybody to care about these people.
Another thing, if I have to hear about the handful of millionaires in Thailand, I'm gonna croak! What about the Thai people who are suffering. Why isn't the media covering what hass happened to Sumatra now. How about some coverage Sri Lanka (other than the resort area) The list goes on & on. Is it just me or do the broadcast companies seem to be worried about has happened to the wealthy tourists? I would like to see an in-depth segemnt on the neediest nations, where they were before & how the quake & tidal wave has affected them. Then, go on to cover what the rest of the world can do to help these people beyond the tsunami after effects. Like help build roads, increase jobs, education & FEED THESE PEOPLE etc.
Tsunami donations are nice. For God's sake, they need a helping hand beyond what the natural disaster has done to them.

Parker Aislin
Parker Aislin

Dec-30-2004 21:58

117,000 people dead and the expected number of deaths is 400,000

jstkdn
jstkdn
Well-Connected

Dec-31-2004 07:28

I would agree with MadamTbird. However, warning systems are not only for seequakes, which are rare. However, Sumatra has been plagued with Volcano eruptions. Bangladesh and India with floods. Then there are hurricanes etc.
There needs the be no expensive monitoring systems at all. As they are already there. It is a matter of a phone call of those that do, and a coordinated effort of some kind. In Asia, almost everywhere even in the poorest of regions, there are loud speakers, for temples, mosques, cars with those announcement speakers. A great many, ironically even the poorest have a TV, or a radio. Usually shared by the neighbourhood. TV is for the poorest even their entertainment (we are after all not talking subsaharan Africa where it concerns Asia), as they can not afford other entertainment. So madamTbird, I suggest you were talking about me, where you say people, as I am the only one that mentioned it. Unfortunately you assumed billions of dollars, where I am talking about a warning system, that can be much easier achieved. And to organize that in the areas hit in Asia....THERE IS MONEY!
Yes there are starving people, yes there are bigger issues. But you can trust me, the wealth you see governments have in those countries, is unlike one you have EVER seen in the west. In terms of the luxery they bath in. I do think it is rather rude, to tell me to shut up. As if I don't know what I am talking about. The fact that I spent many years in Asia, and lived all over the world, and hold a Masters Degree in International Law specialization in human rights, law and economy of underdeveloped countries. I think says I am not the first moron of the street.
I also don't think you do the Asian people justice, in what you say, no education, no food, no jobs, no roads. They have roads, infrastructure is not a problem. No education, even in the countries hit, there is a good education system, in fact it is mandatory for children to go to school, except for far away areas

jstkdn
jstkdn
Well-Connected

Dec-31-2004 07:38

the government can't reach, or anyone else. They are not dying of hunger like in Africa, again with the exception of the far away people. There are enough of jobs. However, people have to work VERY hard, to get little of what we have, and only on the border of barely enough, or just not enough. This with the exception of Bangladesh in the regions hit.

Yes we should have gotten together to help these countries. After all WE underdeveloped them, with the colonizing countries in the lead of that. We underdeveloped them in the 19th century and before, allowing us a head start, and over there putting a government in place that was corrupt, and liked working in a hierarchy of some own all, some get scraps.
All I want to say is, Asia is NOT the backward place you describe it to be. Frankly, I think the Asians can be proud by the amount of recovery of our plundering. Sure people live in shacks and stuff, but in their culture and climate people spend more time with each other, in the village square. They own one of the richest cultures in the world. I think I can say this, as I come from an Indonesian family myself.

The problem is. We see them as backward, as not part of the world, as developing countries. Asia has done a huge amount of development. We refuse to see them as economic beings to reccon with. Other then putting OUR factories up there, and let people work under terrible conditions, because they don't have the labour + environmental laws we do. Ironically those multinationals during the big donations now, are the ones that broke every humanright in terms of labour and environment for decades over there.
Example: Royal Dutch Shell, Coca Cola, Nike, Royal Dutch Phillips, the entire clothing industry, etc etc etc. We as the western world, owning international corporations are all guilty of it. I am glad they are donating huge sums now. It is at least some payment, for what we destroyed. I wrote my thesis, and researched, it is shocking!!!!




jstkdn
jstkdn
Well-Connected

Dec-31-2004 07:51

Before anyone asks, my family is Javanese. Although Java is the island next to Sumatra, it was still far enough. Everybody is fine.
There is one friend I still have not been able to locate in Sumatra, I am in touch with his family over here, and we are waiting for word. However, we know we can not reach his cell outside of Singapore. There is stuff going on with the land lines in Medan, even on a regular day they are hard to reach, or you get a lot of delay from the satellite. I am still hopeful, as I heard the Sumatran effort is coordinated from Medan, and aid workers are flown in to there.


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