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Proposed solution to the writing limit dilemma
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Autumnsprings
Autumnsprings
Con Artist

Aug-28-2016 07:10

So it looks like some of those who received PMs regarding the proposed fix haven't forwarded it to their teammates.
In the interest on everyone having the same information I'm sharing it here. Riza wants to know if we go through with this plan or handle it a different way. First, her message:

"So here's the plan. I'm going to survey all the teams. If at least 3 of them say they are willing to revise and resubmit their pieces, then we'll scrap the original entries and use the new ones. Except this time, there will be explicitly stated word limits and content guidelines. And I will be running it."


Here are my thoughts:

The proposed "fix" of a rewrite is no fix at all.
the contestants all put a LOT of work into their submissions. we shouldn't have to do that work over again, while trying to do this week's events as well.

Here's my suggestion:

Maybe those who were within the stated limit should be given the chance to submit their ORIGINAL entries (as long as it's under 5000 characters and those who went over shouldn't.

That way, the event would count so the work put into them wouldn't be disregarded.

Those who wrote according to the stated rules wouldn't have to do a complete rewrite. And those who went over wouldn't be penalized.

If three teams agree to Riza's suggestion, it will be implemented. If at least three teams do not vote yes, I hope they will implement my suggestion. It seems the most fair way to deal with this.

I am getting to get at play two teams to vote no.

Replies

Yeti Face
Yeti Face
Pinball Amateur

Aug-28-2016 12:18

I'll specify that they should be scored AND added to the actual tallies. Else the scoring doesn't really count, does it? No one should have to rewrite anything, everyone worked to the rules as they understood them. Just give the people who weren't told they could go over the limit and so stayed under it some bonus points to equal things out then proceed with the scoring as usual.

Joseph Zeo
Joseph Zeo
Tale Spinner

Aug-28-2016 12:24

Hi Everyone! This is your friendly neighborhood RP judges speaking.

While the discussions on the rules and length limits & everything in between had been going on, the three of us were reading and rereading the lovely entries, and each of us had given them a grade and some feedback. We've developed a system where there'd be a penalty of 1 grade point taken for those who went over by one post (B+ to a B ), and 2 grade points for those who went over by two posts (B+ to a B- ), and we were close to computing an average between the three of us.

The organizer made a good suggestion to have a rewrite due to the existing issues, which we respect and appreciate. I personally agree with them too, that good writing requires rework over and over again. However, given the time already spent and time participants do not have (and that everyone has a different idea on the appropriate length for the entries), this solution cannot be implemented at this point.

The judges therefore suggested to the organizers that we go ahead with the grading of the entries as it was, and received a green light from them. We shall post the results on the RP board soon, please give us some time to compute the grades and summarize the comments. Please note too, that our grading system is transparent, but not subject to further discussion. We have a very intelligent group of players in Noir, and many your suggestions were sound and some even better than the original ones proposed. In a large group we all need to make room and compromises, and we thank you for being understanding and encompassing.

I'd like to personally thank Breit & Riza for organizing such a behemoth game, although I've been in and out and have no idea why we end up with so many threads.... (took me a while to find the entries every time i need to come in as a judge; it's first day of high school all over again). This Olympic journey is near the end, and I respect all the athlete here who poured their heart and sweats into it.

Joseph Zeo
Joseph Zeo
Tale Spinner

Aug-28-2016 12:27

Sorry Yeti, i didn't see your posts until now (was busy writing ^)

It is a sound suggestion and way more positive then what us diabolic judges thought of last week, but i hope we'll stick to our grading system, otherwise the entries cannot be judged until Christmas...

DevilishWings
DevilishWings
Charioteer

Aug-28-2016 12:32

Now that Joseph has posted, it doesn't really matter anymore, and I'm not really sure how all the scoring has gone down (until she posts, that is) but for future games there should be points for multiple things - creativity, flow, etc, . In that case, simply adding another thread of "respected 2000 limit" would have been easy.

Yeti Face
Yeti Face
Pinball Amateur

This reply has been deleted by a Moderator

Sultry De Mon
Sultry De Mon
Con Artist

Aug-28-2016 12:36

Thank you Joseph, I truly like the decision that has been made. Thank you to the judges and organizers who have put so much thought and effort into this solution. And thank you for reading the ideas and opinions expressed by the community.

Yeti Face
Yeti Face
Pinball Amateur

Aug-28-2016 12:37

Ignore my last reply, I was being very ditzy (Ms Helen will be delighted).

The solution you've opted for also sounds fair, Joseph. It works out the same way. :)

Autumnsprings
Autumnsprings
Con Artist

Aug-28-2016 12:38

I haven't read everything yet, but I feel I need to address Molly's post now.


"We all understand that it can be confusing or frustrating but even more voices chiming in saying we should do this and we should do that, squabbling with each other, stirring drama etc only adds to the fray, frustrates the people who dedicated their time to putting this together, frustrates the players who worked hard and unfortunately the drama reinforces the reason that so many Sleuth vets have thrown up their hands and left this game altogether."

Riza ASKED for thoughts and feedback. It became clear to me not everyone had received her message. Since I didn't know who had and who hadn't, this seemed the most efficient and effective way to get that message out so the Riza could receive the feedback she asked for.

I did not make this post to complain or criticize about the leaders or organizers. Yes I voiced my opinion, but as I said RIZA ASKED FOR FEEDBACK. I'm putting it in caps since you seem to have missed that in my original post.

And you may be interested to know I have actually already begun discussions with another player about hosting the next games.

Vulkie3
Vulkie3
Haynes

Aug-28-2016 12:40

Thank you Joseph, for posting. I'm glad that we've finally reached the end of this stalemate we were having.

I'd also like to thank everyone for their input and feedback. It shows that, while discussing these things with eachother, we try to reach a consensus. And for this, it was a hard one to reach.

But I agree with Devilish - for the next Olympics, it might be better to stick with an indication of 2500 - 3000 characters. That way, you'll ensure that everyone can vary and still stay in that range :) - and if you go over a bit, it won't matter that much as it did in this particular case...

Autumnsprings
Autumnsprings
Con Artist

Aug-28-2016 12:40

And now Helen's comment. I agree with you. It was a lot of fun until it wasn't. And yes they should be judged. I think all the writers worked their asses off, regardless of what limit they followed.

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